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	<title>Comments on: Does Calling for Clinton&#8217;s Ouster Equate to Sexism?</title>
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	<link>http://commentsfromleftfield.com/2008/05/does-calling-for-clintons-ouster-equate-to-sexism</link>
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		<title>By: Why Couldn&#8217;t Someone Have Put It This Way Earlier? &#124; Comments from Left Field</title>
		<link>http://commentsfromleftfield.com/2008/05/does-calling-for-clintons-ouster-equate-to-sexism/comment-page-1#comment-35276</link>
		<dc:creator>Why Couldn&#8217;t Someone Have Put It This Way Earlier? &#124; Comments from Left Field</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 May 2008 03:21:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://commentsfromleftfield.com/?p=4087#comment-35276</guid>
		<description>[...] But, as is pretty obvious, there have been lingering concerns on my mind.  While I have pulled back from the crowd of voices calling for Clinton to quit, for instance, I have remained curious about the idea that calling for Clinton&#8217;s retirement from the race is misogynist behavior. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] But, as is pretty obvious, there have been lingering concerns on my mind.  While I have pulled back from the crowd of voices calling for Clinton to quit, for instance, I have remained curious about the idea that calling for Clinton&#8217;s retirement from the race is misogynist behavior. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: tas</title>
		<link>http://commentsfromleftfield.com/2008/05/does-calling-for-clintons-ouster-equate-to-sexism/comment-page-1#comment-35194</link>
		<dc:creator>tas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 15:44:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://commentsfromleftfield.com/?p=4087#comment-35194</guid>
		<description>On the notion of being &quot;blind to privilege,&quot; it basically means the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.amptoons.com/blog/the-male-privilege-checklist/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;male privilege checklist&lt;/a&gt;.  Which is good for us men to give a look over since there any many things on therer that we don&#039;t think about, can&#039;t experience being slighted for, and can only realize through the eyes of others. 

However, and sorta bleeding into Kathy&#039;s points, I do think that sexism and pointing out of privileges can be used as catch-all excuses; a crutch.  It makes matters too simplistic (which is something I&#039;ve pointed out at Shakesville, only to get insulted, name-called, and berated.  (So much for them arguing with friends using counterpoints; and back then, I was a friend of the blog, but no more.)  So whenever women who support Hillary because of her gender accuse Obama supporters of sexism, I roll my eyes.  None of them have asked me what my problem with Hillary is, they just assume my problem with Hillary stems from the fact that she has a vagina.  I&#039;m no longer in the mood to argue with people who reduce movements like feminism to mindless sloganeering -- using the movement as a crutch to harbor simple-minded views and infest ignorance upon the rest of us. 

Given my proximity to feminism, and the support I received from feminist bloggers during my Loaded Mouth days, I guess I can speak as a former insider now looking in, embarrassed to see who has taken my place.  All in all, if some bloggers in the feminist movement have trouble talking with people such as myself, then I think they need to reexamine their own rhetoric.  I&#039;m not the problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On the notion of being &#8220;blind to privilege,&#8221; it basically means the <a href="http://www.amptoons.com/blog/the-male-privilege-checklist/" rel="nofollow">male privilege checklist</a>.  Which is good for us men to give a look over since there any many things on therer that we don&#8217;t think about, can&#8217;t experience being slighted for, and can only realize through the eyes of others. </p>
<p>However, and sorta bleeding into Kathy&#8217;s points, I do think that sexism and pointing out of privileges can be used as catch-all excuses; a crutch.  It makes matters too simplistic (which is something I&#8217;ve pointed out at Shakesville, only to get insulted, name-called, and berated.  (So much for them arguing with friends using counterpoints; and back then, I was a friend of the blog, but no more.)  So whenever women who support Hillary because of her gender accuse Obama supporters of sexism, I roll my eyes.  None of them have asked me what my problem with Hillary is, they just assume my problem with Hillary stems from the fact that she has a vagina.  I&#8217;m no longer in the mood to argue with people who reduce movements like feminism to mindless sloganeering &#8212; using the movement as a crutch to harbor simple-minded views and infest ignorance upon the rest of us. </p>
<p>Given my proximity to feminism, and the support I received from feminist bloggers during my Loaded Mouth days, I guess I can speak as a former insider now looking in, embarrassed to see who has taken my place.  All in all, if some bloggers in the feminist movement have trouble talking with people such as myself, then I think they need to reexamine their own rhetoric.  I&#8217;m not the problem.</p>
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		<title>By: DrGail</title>
		<link>http://commentsfromleftfield.com/2008/05/does-calling-for-clintons-ouster-equate-to-sexism/comment-page-1#comment-35177</link>
		<dc:creator>DrGail</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 13:26:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://commentsfromleftfield.com/?p=4087#comment-35177</guid>
		<description>Having been the victim of sexism and discrimination on more than one occasion, as a woman pioneering a largely male-dominated field, perhaps I have a slightly different perspective.

Let me first establish that, in this case, I don&#039;t think it&#039;s a reflection of sexism to call for Hillary to bow out of the primary race.  Facts are facts and math is math:  She can&#039;t win this thing.  That&#039;s unfortunate and I can truly empathize with what has become (yet another) public humiliation for her, but she can&#039;t win.  

There might be a better claim that sexism reared its head in the voting; that is, that some folks would not and did not vote for her simply because she&#039;s a woman.  I would actually be reasonably receptive to arguments of that kind.

When one has been the victim of sexism, or any form of discrimination I suppose, it can be very tempting to see any failure or disappointment as further evidence of the discrimination.  This, however, becomes self-reflexive.  That is, it can block you from truly learning something from the situation which can perhaps help you overcome inherent or imposed disadvantages in the future.  

It&#039;s much easier to say &quot;I didn&#039;t get that job because that company is sexist&quot; than to admit &quot;I didn&#039;t get that job because I interviewed poorly&quot; or whatever.  Perhaps there was a kernel of sexism involved, but focusing on that alone really doesn&#039;t help matters.  Unless, of course, your objective is simply to be pissed off rather than to improve your chances for the next job.

In some ways, it seems like putting every defeat a woman ever endures into the bucket of &quot;sexism&quot; really just serves to keep the whole problem alive by reinforcing observers&#039; sexist notions that a woman can&#039;t take the pressure, isn&#039;t willing to take responsibility for what happens to her, etc.

I think that, as time permits later on today, I&#039;ll put up a post expanding on these notions.  Just as this primary race has brought issues of racism into the realm of serious discussion, perhaps sexism should be addressed as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having been the victim of sexism and discrimination on more than one occasion, as a woman pioneering a largely male-dominated field, perhaps I have a slightly different perspective.</p>
<p>Let me first establish that, in this case, I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s a reflection of sexism to call for Hillary to bow out of the primary race.  Facts are facts and math is math:  She can&#8217;t win this thing.  That&#8217;s unfortunate and I can truly empathize with what has become (yet another) public humiliation for her, but she can&#8217;t win.  </p>
<p>There might be a better claim that sexism reared its head in the voting; that is, that some folks would not and did not vote for her simply because she&#8217;s a woman.  I would actually be reasonably receptive to arguments of that kind.</p>
<p>When one has been the victim of sexism, or any form of discrimination I suppose, it can be very tempting to see any failure or disappointment as further evidence of the discrimination.  This, however, becomes self-reflexive.  That is, it can block you from truly learning something from the situation which can perhaps help you overcome inherent or imposed disadvantages in the future.  </p>
<p>It&#8217;s much easier to say &#8220;I didn&#8217;t get that job because that company is sexist&#8221; than to admit &#8220;I didn&#8217;t get that job because I interviewed poorly&#8221; or whatever.  Perhaps there was a kernel of sexism involved, but focusing on that alone really doesn&#8217;t help matters.  Unless, of course, your objective is simply to be pissed off rather than to improve your chances for the next job.</p>
<p>In some ways, it seems like putting every defeat a woman ever endures into the bucket of &#8220;sexism&#8221; really just serves to keep the whole problem alive by reinforcing observers&#8217; sexist notions that a woman can&#8217;t take the pressure, isn&#8217;t willing to take responsibility for what happens to her, etc.</p>
<p>I think that, as time permits later on today, I&#8217;ll put up a post expanding on these notions.  Just as this primary race has brought issues of racism into the realm of serious discussion, perhaps sexism should be addressed as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Kyle E. Moore</title>
		<link>http://commentsfromleftfield.com/2008/05/does-calling-for-clintons-ouster-equate-to-sexism/comment-page-1#comment-35134</link>
		<dc:creator>Kyle E. Moore</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 09:58:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://commentsfromleftfield.com/?p=4087#comment-35134</guid>
		<description>Mark: I agree with you of course.  Just about everything.  But I am still waiting to hear a rational discussion from someone who doesn&#039;t agree with us.  I mean, i really want to know if it&#039;s just a claim or if there is actually some substance behind it.

Tas, I also noticed that he uses that &quot;blind to privelege&quot; phrase a lot.  What the fuck does that mean, really?

Blind to privelege.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark: I agree with you of course.  Just about everything.  But I am still waiting to hear a rational discussion from someone who doesn&#8217;t agree with us.  I mean, i really want to know if it&#8217;s just a claim or if there is actually some substance behind it.</p>
<p>Tas, I also noticed that he uses that &#8220;blind to privelege&#8221; phrase a lot.  What the fuck does that mean, really?</p>
<p>Blind to privelege.</p>
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		<title>By: tas</title>
		<link>http://commentsfromleftfield.com/2008/05/does-calling-for-clintons-ouster-equate-to-sexism/comment-page-1#comment-35089</link>
		<dc:creator>tas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 05:32:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://commentsfromleftfield.com/?p=4087#comment-35089</guid>
		<description>Fecke tends to see &lt;a href=&quot;http://sugarmyths.blogspot.com/2007/12/true-confessions-of-nice-guy.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;sexism&lt;/a&gt; in &lt;a href=&quot;http://sugarmyths.blogspot.com/2007/12/true-confessions-of-misogynist-asshole.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;everything&lt;/a&gt;.  So I tend not to take him seriously.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fecke tends to see <a href="http://sugarmyths.blogspot.com/2007/12/true-confessions-of-nice-guy.html" rel="nofollow">sexism</a> in <a href="http://sugarmyths.blogspot.com/2007/12/true-confessions-of-misogynist-asshole.html" rel="nofollow">everything</a>.  So I tend not to take him seriously.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://commentsfromleftfield.com/2008/05/does-calling-for-clintons-ouster-equate-to-sexism/comment-page-1#comment-35071</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 04:00:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://commentsfromleftfield.com/?p=4087#comment-35071</guid>
		<description>The trouble with so much of this style of debate is that it becomes a convenient cover for dismissing and falsely discrediting opposing viewpoints out of hand.  Not only does it poison debate and prevent rational discussion of issues, it also has the consequence of cheapening real racism/sexism when it does exist.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The trouble with so much of this style of debate is that it becomes a convenient cover for dismissing and falsely discrediting opposing viewpoints out of hand.  Not only does it poison debate and prevent rational discussion of issues, it also has the consequence of cheapening real racism/sexism when it does exist.</p>
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